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185lb crossbow V fox?

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185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby Wackerrat45 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:20 am

Hi all
I'm wondering, I know my .22 can't take out foxes humanely, but how about a 185lb (315ft ps) crossbow.? Would that provide a clean kill? :?
http://www.verminhunters.co.uk

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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby humperdingle » Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:23 am

Hypothetically, or legally?
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby Wackerrat45 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:48 am

My permission owners are asking if I can kill foxes, I said no due to the power of my .22 air rifle, I was thinking about crossbows and wondered if they would do the job. :?: but just googled the effective range and its less than a air rifle so still unsure. As I see loads of septics shooting big game with crossbows.
http://www.verminhunters.co.uk

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Re: RE: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby jeff » Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:32 am

Legally you can't use a crossbow to hunt or for vermin destruction in the UK.

Technically, much bigger animals are hunted quite humanely with less powerful bows in countries where it is legal, so a crossbow would be up to the task assuming sufficient operator skill.

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Re: RE: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby Wackerrat45 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:44 am

jeff wrote:Legally you can't use a crossbow to hunt or for vwrmin destruction in in the UK.

Technically, much bigger animals are hunted quite humanely with less powerful bows in countries where it is legal, so a crossbow would be up to the task assuming sufficient operator skill.

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Thanks Jeff
I will stick with my usual method & normal game. Let someone else take on foxes, might see if I can buddy up with a FAC shooter if the fox problem gets too much.
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby Judge Ali » Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:56 am

Wackerrat45 wrote: I was thinking about crossbows and wondered if they would do the job. :?: but just googled the effective range and its less than a air rifle so still unsure. As I see loads of septics shooting big game with crossbows.



Mate as you are hosting a site offering a vermin control service you might want to brush up on the law which applies to it or you could potentially end up in trouble or at the least you risk a dent to your credibility. I appreciate you are asking the question here as opposed to giving advice though. As stated it is a definite no no to shoot any species in the UK with a crossbow.

I also do not think you will find many people classing foxes as 'big game' :hmm:
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby Buffy Vampire Slayer » Wed Nov 14, 2012 7:30 am

Alex Gibbs wrote:
Wackerrat45 wrote: I was thinking about crossbows and wondered if they would do the job. :?: but just googled the effective range and its less than a air rifle so still unsure. As I see loads of septics shooting big game with crossbows.



Mate as you are hosting a site offering a vermin control service you might want to brush up on the law which applies to it or you could potentially end up in trouble or at the least you risk a dent to your credibility. I appreciate you are asking the question here as opposed to giving advice though. As stated it is a definite no no to shoot any species in the UK with a crossbow.

I also do not think you will find many people classing foxes as 'big game' :hmm:


just to clarify this at the present time in the UK it is illegal to hunt/kill any animal with any type of bow
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby 247sniper » Wed Nov 14, 2012 8:23 am

A 185lb cross bow would flatten a fox for fun with correct shot placement, providing that the correct bolts (arrows) were used for the job. My competition compound bow when shooting at 100 competitions the arrows would stick out the back of a hardly compressed straw archery boss that was 4 inch thick by 5-6 inches, and my bozw was 55lbs.

Im my day when I use to compete for the GB squad I would be confifdent and qutie capable of dropping a fox at 100 yards and more (Not that i would do it) with my highly tuned compound bow, but like has been said, its not leagal over there and we have no fox over here. ;)

Get the correct and leagal tool for the job mate :thup:

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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby Bushdog » Wed Nov 14, 2012 8:45 am

The Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 definitely did for any archery hunting in the UK.

I'm not convinced about the effectiveness of even very powerful bows (crossbows or conventional) in terms of shooting foxes. The power seems to equate to penetration, but arrows (or bolts) do not do the same internal damage that bullets do - they tend to kill by bleeding out the target rather than direct damage.

While this can be acceptably humane on bigger animals that you can track down and which will not go to earth, I'm not so sure it would work well on foxes and other ground-living game. I think thats why they used to use blunts for rabbits and birds, and a lot of the European hunting crossbows were designed to shoot "bullets" of various sorts - to apply blunt trauma to smaller targets to incapacitate them quickly.
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby plugg » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:39 am

Wackerrat45 wrote:My permission owners are asking if I can kill foxes, I said no due to the power of my .22 air rifle, I was thinking about crossbows and wondered if they would do the job. :?: but just googled the effective range and its less than a air rifle so still unsure. As I see loads of septics shooting big game with crossbows.


Why not apply for an FAC then?

You have permission and 'good reason' and if you are in an area of the country where your licensing authority allows HMR/WMR for fox then you needn't have to get a CF.
Alex Gibbs wrote:
Wackerrat45 wrote: I was thinking about crossbows and wondered if they would do the job. :?: but just googled the effective range and its less than a air rifle so still unsure. As I see loads of septics shooting big game with crossbows.



Mate as you are hosting a site offering a vermin control service you might want to brush up on the law which applies to it or you could potentially end up in trouble or at the least you risk a dent to your credibility. I appreciate you are asking the question here as opposed to giving advice though. As stated it is a definite no no to shoot any species in the UK with a crossbow.



Alex is right mate.

If I called you up and told you I had a problem with 10 Roe deer munching my saplings (in enclosed farmland they are classed as pests) and I would pay you £50, a bit over generous but hey, for every Roe you nailed and you could keep the meat only for you to tell me you (personally) couldn't do it I wouldn't be very chuffed and neither would you!

If someone called me to do the same job in Berwick-upon-Tweed I know I have to have a minimum bullet weight of 50gr and have a minimum muzzle energy of at least 1000ft/lbs and have a muzzle velocity of 2450fps; Id grab the .22-250. If it was the same job was in England, literally just over the border, Id have to grab the .308 as the minimum calibre for taking roe in England is .240"

:)
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby jeff » Wed Nov 14, 2012 11:30 am

247sniper wrote:Im my day when I use to compete for the GB squad I would be confifdent and qutie capable of dropping a fox at 100 yards and more (Not that i would do it) with my highly tuned compound bow, but like has been said, its not leagal over there and we have no fox over here. ;)


Can't remember if we did this on one of the other threads, but can you bow hunt in the IOM??
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby Born Again » Wed Nov 14, 2012 12:14 pm

What about a shotgun ? Easier to get than FAC and effective up to 40yds with good ammo choice.
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby plugg » Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:03 pm

Born Again wrote:What about a shotgun ? Easier to get than FAC and effective up to 40yds with good ammo choice.


I'm not sure a shotgun is the answer either...

Sure, its more than capable with the correct load but its the limited range that it offers.

To nail charlie with a shotty you are looking at a max of 50 yards and that is dependant on all factor being the best. Other factors are if charlie is wounded which direction is he likely to run? What cover will you be offered? Is it safe to discharge a shotgun in what might be close proximity to buildings or livestock? Etc.

A shotty is great for HD if the fox is trapped.

I shot at a fox on Saturday night with the .22-250 and I must have pulled the shot, I got him in the gut at around 120 yards, I had to chase him a further 150 yards before I got a decent safe shot to put him down but he was still a good 100 yards out when he finally fell silent.

Ok, charlie isn't going to be 120 yards away when first engaged but if like me and an arse of it is made on the first shot you might never get a second. Even if he is sighted a second shot from a shotgun at anything more than 50 yards isn't going to be possible.

Just a thought :)
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby humperdingle » Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:42 pm

I wouldn't even shoot a fox at 50 yards with a shotgun.

Problem is, you need a decent sized load and nice, big pellets within it.

Patterning even a 50 gram BB load at 30 yards is pretty sparse, so you can imagine what buckshot would be like. Just too much chance of a horrible injury the fox will escape with.

A suitable centrefire is really the only tool to do a GOOD job IMO.
Last edited by humperdingle on Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 185lb crossbow V fox?

Postby 247sniper » Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:59 pm

Born Again wrote:What about a shotgun ? Easier to get than FAC and effective up to 40yds with good ammo choice.


Not to sure tbh, saying that there is nothing to hunt with anyway, no deer, turkey etc.
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