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Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

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Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Headbanger » Sun Jan 27, 2013 5:43 pm

Hi all.

Whilst shooting some clays earlier today I had a problem with the top barrel not firing.

My nephew had no problems using my gun, I must have had 7 or 8 cartridges which wouldn't fire, we shot 100 cartridges between us.

Is this something I should worry about on a 7 month old gun? I guess it's either me loading incorrectly (unlikely as this is pretty straight forward even for me), the cartridges (possible, as we use the cheapest) or the gun (hope not, don't want to send it off somewhere)!

Any ideas before I phone Avalon guns tomorrow?

Many thanks in advance
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby flintlok » Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:47 pm

Off the top, it sounds like a firing pin issue or it could be something on the order thick primer cup metal that the Ruskies love to place in their commie cartridges. If you're shooting commie crap for ammo the problem can be solve by getting a stronger hammer spring. If the cartridges are UK or American made it may be a firing pin issue. Note that I shoot commie crap in my AR 15's and in the case of the 5.45X39 I had to get a stronger hammer spring to make the cartridges go bang reliably. I haven't had that issue with the 7.62X39 cartridges. I have read that so of the fellows have had similar issues with the Commie pistol primers. I've just bought 5000 large pistol and from what I can discern is if the hammer spring is sufficiently strong the primers will fire reliably.
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Coldfinger » Sun Jan 27, 2013 8:44 pm

Were the cartridges all the same? Were the non-firers the same make?

Did they fire on the second attempt in the same barrel or did you try them again in the lower barrel and fire them off?

Does the same happen with different cartridge brands?

Did you see anything strange with the primer dents? Comparing primer dents for cartridges from top & bottom barrels would indicate if the strike was heavier with the lower barrel than with the top.

Were the dents the same shape or do the dents suggest that the one pin is different to the other (damaged pin, offset pin etc.

I'm not an expert on the Beretta but can you change the setting so that the firing order is swapped over? If yes then does the problem disappear when the firing order is changed?
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby gun nut » Mon Jan 28, 2013 9:40 am

It sounds like you are saying the top barrel would not fire at all for you sometimes but was ok for your nephew???
IIRC Silver Pigeons are inertia block operated and it is not uncommon for one person to have a problem with them not resetting to the second barrel while others can use it without any problems.
This tends to be worse with low powered, light clay loads that don't have enough ummppphhh to reset the block.
If you answer Coldfingers questions we should be able to give you a better diagnosis!
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby humperdingle » Mon Jan 28, 2013 9:44 am

gun nut wrote:It sounds like you are saying the top barrel would not fire at all for you sometimes but was ok for your nephew???
IIRC Silver Pigeons are inertia block operated and it is not uncommon for one person to have a problem with them not resetting to the second barrel while others can use it without any problems.
This tends to be worse with low powered, light clay loads that don't have enough ummppphhh to reset the block.
If you answer Coldfingers questions we should be able to give you a better diagnosis!

That would be my 1st guess... Poor mount or too much soft padding at recoil pad will often stop pin resetting.
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Buffy Vampire Slayer » Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:06 am

humperdingle wrote:
gun nut wrote:It sounds like you are saying the top barrel would not fire at all for you sometimes but was ok for your nephew???
IIRC Silver Pigeons are inertia block operated and it is not uncommon for one person to have a problem with them not resetting to the second barrel while others can use it without any problems.
This tends to be worse with low powered, light clay loads that don't have enough ummppphhh to reset the block.
If you answer Coldfingers questions we should be able to give you a better diagnosis!

That would be my 1st guess... Poor mount or too much soft padding at recoil pad will often stop pin resetting.


really :shock: :shock:
i`ve never come across this happening,even if i`ve fired a o&u unmounted just held in my hands in order to get a bit of "flight action" going when the shooting has been slack :!:
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby humperdingle » Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:39 pm

Buffy Vampire Slayer wrote:
humperdingle wrote:
gun nut wrote:It sounds like you are saying the top barrel would not fire at all for you sometimes but was ok for your nephew???
IIRC Silver Pigeons are inertia block operated and it is not uncommon for one person to have a problem with them not resetting to the second barrel while others can use it without any problems.
This tends to be worse with low powered, light clay loads that don't have enough ummppphhh to reset the block.
If you answer Coldfingers questions we should be able to give you a better diagnosis!

That would be my 1st guess... Poor mount or too much soft padding at recoil pad will often stop pin resetting.


really :shock: :shock:
i`ve never come across this happening,even if i`ve fired a o&u unmounted just held in my hands in order to get a bit of "flight action" going when the shooting has been slack :!:

Depends on the gun, how sensitive the reset mechanism is, what type, etc.
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Sidebyside » Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:07 pm

Buffy Vampire Slayer wrote:
humperdingle wrote:
gun nut wrote:It sounds like you are saying the top barrel would not fire at all for you sometimes but was ok for your nephew???
IIRC Silver Pigeons are inertia block operated and it is not uncommon for one person to have a problem with them not resetting to the second barrel while others can use it without any problems.
This tends to be worse with low powered, light clay loads that don't have enough ummppphhh to reset the block.
If you answer Coldfingers questions we should be able to give you a better diagnosis!

That would be my 1st guess... Poor mount or too much soft padding at recoil pad will often stop pin resetting.


really :shock: :shock:
i`ve never come across this happening,even if i`ve fired a o&u unmounted just held in my hands in order to get a bit of "flight action" going when the shooting has been slack :!:

I must admit I too have never come across that , I would have thought for that situation to arise the gun itself has a very inadequate mechanism , If that was the case using snap caps would be a no no as the next time you loaded with cartridges it wouldn't be cocked , or am I missing your point here . :?
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby humperdingle » Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:13 pm

Sidebyside wrote:
Buffy Vampire Slayer wrote:
humperdingle wrote:
gun nut wrote:It sounds like you are saying the top barrel would not fire at all for you sometimes but was ok for your nephew???
IIRC Silver Pigeons are inertia block operated and it is not uncommon for one person to have a problem with them not resetting to the second barrel while others can use it without any problems.
This tends to be worse with low powered, light clay loads that don't have enough ummppphhh to reset the block.
If you answer Coldfingers questions we should be able to give you a better diagnosis!

That would be my 1st guess... Poor mount or too much soft padding at recoil pad will often stop pin resetting.


really :shock: :shock:
i`ve never come across this happening,even if i`ve fired a o&u unmounted just held in my hands in order to get a bit of "flight action" going when the shooting has been slack :!:

I must admit I too have never come across that , I would have thought for that situation to arise the gun itself has a very inadequate mechanism , If that was the case using snap caps would be a no no as the next time you loaded with cartridges it wouldn't be cocked , or am I missing your point here . :?


You can bang on the end of the recoil pad to reset for 2nd barrel on this type.
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Hornet 6 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:50 pm

Are you firing the top barrel first or second ?
If top is first are you sure the gun is shutting and locking correctly, action all nice and clean ?
If second are you sure you are releasing your hold on the trigger between shots ?

Neil. :)
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Buffy Vampire Slayer » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:58 pm

Headbanger wrote:Hi all.

Whilst shooting some clays earlier today I had a problem with the top barrel not firing.

My nephew had no problems using my gun, I must have had 7 or 8 cartridges which wouldn't fire, we shot 100 cartridges between us.

Is this something I should worry about on a 7 month old gun? I guess it's either me loading incorrectly (unlikely as this is pretty straight forward even for me), the cartridges (possible, as we use the cheapest) or the gun (hope not, don't want to send it off somewhere)!

Any ideas before I phone Avalon guns tomorrow?

Many thanks in advance


which barrel were you trying to fire first :?:
are you positive the gun was fully broken during the loading process :?:
was there a "click" as you`d here when using snap caps :?:
was there evidence of the primer being struck :?:
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Headbanger » Wed Jan 30, 2013 9:13 pm

[quote="Coldfinger"]Were the cartridges all the same? Were the non-firers the same make? Yes and yes.

Did they fire on the second attempt in the same barrel or did you try them again in the lower barrel and fire them off? Moved them to the lower barrel each time and they fired fine.

Does the same happen with different cartridge brands?
It has happened twice before (only to me thinking about it), with better cartridges

Did you see anything strange with the primer dents? Comparing primer dents for cartridges from top & bottom barrels would indicate if the strike was heavier with the lower barrel than with the top.
Can't say as though I thought to look at that.

Were the dents the same shape or do the dents suggest that the one pin is different to the other (damaged pin, offset pin etc.
Again, didn't think to look - doh. Unfortunately as a newbie it didn't occour to look.

I'm not an expert on the Beretta but can you change the setting so that the firing order is swapped over? If yes then does the problem disappear when the firing order is changed?
See previous answer.

The bottom barrel was being fired first.

Thanks for all the posts, sorry I haven't got back sooner.

I'm beginning to think it's probably me and not the gun. :Facepalm: Was the gun fully broken during loading etc? I can't honestly say. And the fact my nephew hasn't had a problem, will try again at the w/end & let you know.

Many thanks for your time and answers.
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby smellywelly » Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:37 pm

humperdingle wrote:You can bang on the end of the recoil pad to reset for 2nd barrel on this type.


A dealer demonstrated this function to me on this gun when I looked at one and felt quite un easy about it being a recognised way of cocking a gun/or preparing it to fire :(
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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Coldfinger » Thu Jan 31, 2013 12:17 am

OK, been reading.

The tear-drop safety mechanism is also the barrel order selector so I think you slide the device up/down for the safety and flick it left/right for the firing order or vice versa. See pic below.

When you use the gun make sure that you pull the gun into your shoulder correctly and not go floppy with the first shot since the recoil is light and you need to offer some resistance to aid the reset.

Do not change the firing order but try the shoulder resistance first. If your gun still does not fire the second shot then change the order and see if the upper barrel fires but the lower one fails to fire. This will tell you if the firing pin is the problem.

Remember to look at the primers, do they indent the same? Do the one(s) which do not fire even have an impression in them?

If you get some cartridges that do not fire then open the gun and keep the non-fired cartridge in same barrel but change the order of firing and see if they go on the second go.

Try a few with a "weak" shoulder and see if you can exacerbate the non-firing to prove it is your posture/stance which is causing the problem.

Maybe some of the other guys have a suggestion or two so buy a couple of extra boxes of shells :grin:

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Re: Beretta Silver Pigeon 1 problem?

Postby Bushdog » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:56 am

On my Beretta Silver HAwk SxS (again with a single trigger and barrel selector safety) the other way of setting the mechanism to the other barrel is simply to move the barrel selector on the safety - you don't have to bump the stock at all, unless you want to simulate firing the gun with no cartridges in it.
I found this out when putting in snap caps for storage - initially I was banging on the stock, but then tried the selector and it works fine.
None of this has anything to do with cocking the gun - I think thats done the same way as usual, by opening the barrels.
Suggest you get a couple of snap caps and experiment with the selector button so that you are sure of how that works, too.
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